GPW 53?

[Benleroy]

Hi' G'

I know this is the wrong section to share this link but i've found this interesting auction on ebay.

It's a set of brass dataplates from a GPW dated 2-25-42, number.... 53! VEP Ford GPW!!

Amazing!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/willys-j ... ccessories




We will allow this due to the importance of the plates, however, do remember under normal conditions this post would have been moved to the Auction Board.
This should not be viewed as setting a precedence.
ADMIN

[Tom Wolboldt]

Hi,

Thanks for making this post !

From my GPW studies, GPW 53 should have come from the Dallas assembly plant. It should have been about the 70th to the 90th GPW assembled at Dallas. GPW 55 should have also been from Dallas and has the same DoD.

The really interesting thing is that I have not seen this style serial number data plate before. This plate must have only been used for a very short time.

[robert de ruyter]

My first feeling is that this plate is not original. First, for (the Dallas plant) in February I only have seen style 1 brass dataplates. Ford GPW Style 1 is the same style as style 2 used on the Willys MB, the only difference is that the text WILLYS MB has been changed on the Ford plate in FORD GPW. (Maybe these first GPW plates came from the same place as were the Willys plates were made?)
Second, I have seen so many GPW plates, in picture and in real, I have large doubts this is an original plate. Also look at other Ford plates from the Dallas plant, the "3" is this GPW 53 plate does not have the double rounded shape as all Dallas stamped plates. Also the "4" looks like it is open in top of the figure, all other Dallas stamped plates have a closed "4".

This is ofcource my opinion! Looking forward to read other opinions.
Or the see other plates like this!

Robert
www.dataplates4u.com

[Schultzd]

Although I am certainly no expert on these things, I do get frustrated with this type issue. I don't believe anyone really knows what happened at these factorys on a day-by-day basis. I think almost anything can and did happen. This is early production, maybe things weren't quite set in stone yet, maybe they used a different punch set after the beginning. If someone were to have re-created these plates, they worked extra hard to make the general appearance to be genuine. Quite frankly, I don't think anyone would go to that much trouble.

For instance, I have a very original M38 with all the plates, but the experts state catagorically that some were replaced when the winch was installed. I don't believe it. All the plates appear to have been installed at the factory, if they could see the plates in person, they would see that.

Bottom line is, all assumptions we make regarding these things could be wrong!

Just my thoughts.

Dan

[robert de ruyter]

Something I forgot to mention in my first reply, the layout of the plates and the font used is totaly different then all orginal GPW plates is I have seen.
And as I wrote before, it is my opinion..

Robert

[Chuck Lutz]

Robert...since we have seen some data plates for trailers that were available around the end of WWII, I wonder if this is a period correct data plate that was found and used at a later time for GPW 53?

Here are some examples that if did not KNOW they were not factory data plates, the age of them could fool you into thinking they WERE the original data plates....

Replacement Data Plate.jpg (244.34 KiB) Viewed 1488 times

or this one William found on a trailer (pop rivets!)

Replacement Plate William in Belgium.jpg (35.95 KiB) Viewed 1476 times

This one actually looks "original"...

Replacement Data Plate Jeep.jpg (91.5 KiB) Viewed 1477 times

[robert de ruyter]

Chuck, I can agree with your point of view that it could be a post war replacement plate.

Robert

[GI jeeps]

Just because we find something that does not fit our expected patterns doesn't mean it is wrong. With a tag so early I don't know that we really have a standard to judge them by. GPW 53's dogtags look legit to me though a few things strike me as odd.
Wish the rest of it was still around.

[Chuck Lutz]

Not only is the NOMENCLATURE tag in the middle different, the CAUTION tag on the right is also different from those originals on GPWs in the First GPW Contract in terms of layout/font/etc. .....

Pics of GPW 55 data plates would be helpful for a comparison!

Notice GPW 287 was also a 2-25-42 Dallas GPW!

GPW 287 2-25-42.jpg (40.58 KiB) Viewed 1401 times

The spacing of letters is not the same on 53 as on 287 and other Dallas data plates!
Note the "4 top is closed.....the "3" is rounded.....

Now....note where the lettering for "QUARTERMASTER CORPS" is in relationship to the next line "FORD GPW"

GPW 55.jpg (42.17 KiB) Viewed 1393 times

Now on this one:

GPW 17963 4-24-42 Chuck.jpg (225.86 KiB) Viewed 1402 times

So the data plate on GPW 53 is VERY different from that of GPW 287 and GPW 17963. In fact I wonder if ANYONE has a data plate from Ford that has a "flat-topped" number "3" in it at all??????/

[nirvana]

Love when something I am watching gets posted.....I guess there goes any hope of bidding on it at a reasonable price. Thanks guys....

[wayne douglas]

eh???? I have GPW #1728 and its DOD is 2-20-42???

how did one which is 5 days later than mine have a serial number of 53???

[Chuck Lutz]

Because GPWs get their serial number from the MOTOR NUMBER when it is installed into a frame. The Rouge plant that makes the engine assemblies sends them in batches, the factory that produces the jeep is not required to assemble them numerically. So storage (Filo/Lifo) issues at the Rouge plant, the distance, mode ot transportation and shipping schedules to each factory, storage (again, Filo/Lifo) issues all work to effect the order in which the numbered motors are used. Add to that any holdback on a completed jeep that would put it further back into production dates, the eventual serial number/DOD can vary.

The number of factories and the speed with which they produced their jeeps also is important.

[Tom Wolboldt]

Hi Group,

Also, many times GPW motors did not get sequantial serial numbers as they were assembled at the Motor Assembly Building. I do not think this is the case with GPW 1728 and GPW 53.

When it comes to GPWs almost nothing is as clean cut as authors over the years have made it out to be.