New Hand Cart questions

WW1 & 2 Hand Carts Any Country NO EBAY OR COMMERCIAL SALES
blitz67
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New Hand Cart questions

Post by blitz67 » Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:38 pm

I picked up my first hand cart this past weekend, ordered all the parts I need from Ed Snyder, but I have a question about the screws that go through the floor and hold the axle to the frame. Are these standard bolts that I can get from the hardware store or a special type bolt. Just hard to tell as they are so worn down from age.

Brad


blitz67
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by blitz67 » Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:39 pm

picture
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jfo137
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by jfo137 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 12:32 pm

blitz67,
If you look down the hand cart forum you will see two topics about the bolts. The one "correct bolt" has all information on size, thread and length. The bolts seem to be the magic part that are not easy to come by. If you find a source please share!!!!! My cart restoration has been on hold because of the bolts…..or lack there of.

Great looking find by the way. What parts is Ed making for you?

Good luck on the bolt hunt!
jfo137

blitz67
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by blitz67 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:22 pm

I am going to check in to getting the bolts made, found a place just waiting on pricing. I'll let you know what I find out.

Brad

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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by frenchman » Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:46 pm

good looking cart brad should be an easy restoration
frenchman

jfo137
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by jfo137 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:39 pm

There have been several guys looking for bolts. Might be cheaper if several sets are made. Looking forward to finding out!

rjbeamer
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by rjbeamer » Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:48 pm

You can make your own bolts. Cut the head off of 5/16"-24 nf bolts to the needed length. Weld on an extra thick flat washer. (Mc Master Carr # 98099a029) Chuck the welded bolt up into a hand drill and with the drill running form the shape of the truss head using a sander or grinder. The finished OD. of the head is right at .630" with a very low profile or dome. Cut the screw driver slot with a hack saw or 1/32" cut off wheel. The nut to use is an early Ford 289/302 CU IN rod nut. It is the exact size as the correct nut that was used. 5/16"-24 fine thread .355" tall. You can cut the slots in the nut with a hack saw. The slots in the nut are .155" long or down from the top and about .035" wide (same width of most hack saw blades.) The flat washers that i noted above are 1/4" bolt size with a 9/32" ID. You might enlarge the hole if needed based on the actual OD. of the 5/16"-24 nf bolts that you are using but you want a tight fit of the bolt shank into the washer. The ones that i did turned out great and look just like NOS. (The 289/302 Ford rod nuts can be bought at any good automotive parts house or on Ebay. (The ones I used were made by pioneer #CRN610.)

Look at the 1st post on the 2nd page of this post as their is a good picture of the correct screws/bolts.

Roger
Last edited by rjbeamer on Fri May 09, 2014 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

brad
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by brad » Fri May 02, 2014 12:24 pm

you can buy the correct bolts with the correct head and the correct length the issue is the threads the original is a 18 NC thread which i have found with the incorect head so what i am doing is i am going to use the bolt i have found with the correct head and length but it has the 24 NC thread no one will ever know unless they get so close to count and observe the threads of course you will know, and then i will replace them at a later date if some are found or reproduced


Brad Stansbury

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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by rjbeamer » Fri May 02, 2014 1:26 pm

Brad I think that you have your TPI. turned around. 5/16"-24 Tpi is Nat. Fine thread. That is also what came on the cart. The screws or bolts were in 3 lengths 1", 1 1/4", 1 3/4". All of them were 5/16"-24 Nf.Truss head sloted screws. To my knowledge these are not available any where. Mc Master Carr has truss head sloted screws or bolts in 5/16"-18 or Nat. course only. An example would be # 90271A583 which is I" in length. They are zink plated but the zink can be bead blasted or sanded off if you want to use NC screws.

Roger

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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by blitz67 » Fri May 02, 2014 2:12 pm

I found 1 1/2" slotted truss head screws 5/16 x 24 but they are stainless steel

rjbeamer
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by rjbeamer » Fri May 02, 2014 3:26 pm

Blitz67: If you bead blast stainless steel the OD paint will bond well and work great. The two 1 3/4" long screws that hold on the front clamp for the tongue are a little longer than needed. 1 1/2" screws will poss. work. Can you get shorter ones, if not cut them off for the 1" and 1 1/4" one's needed. If you use NF screws then you can use the 289/302 rod nuts. With that set up you will pass the 3 foot rule. In looking I see where Fastenal has 1 1/2"-24 truss head slotted in S.S. as the only length listed. Those will work. I also see on google that there is a vendor selling 5/16"-24 truss head slotted screws for wheel chair use 1 3/4" long. Problem is they are a combination slotted and phillips head and would not look good. I supose that you could weld up the top of the head and dress up the slot. They were very pricy tho. about $5.00 each. All things considered i think that the 1 1/2" S.S. screws from Fastenal would be the best bet if you use stainless steel.

Roger

Ps. There were some real disapointed folks at TP when you beat them to the draw on buying that cart. Great find.

brad
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by brad » Wed May 07, 2014 6:35 am

You are right i do have the thread backwards having said that fastenal has the correct head and correct lenghts except 1 bolt lenght these are in the 18 nc thread and these are what i am using untill the 100% correct bolts are made or found

jfo137
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by jfo137 » Wed May 07, 2014 6:58 pm

Sorry if I am beating this bolt issues to death.... But if I understand the original bolts were 5/16 24 NF and 1, 1 1/4, 1 3/4 in length. The cart I have has several hardware store bolts mixed in with originals. If someone would be so kind could you let me know what lengths went where.
Thanks for all the information and help.
Jim

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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by rjbeamer » Wed May 07, 2014 7:22 pm

jfo137. It takes 10 total 1" screws to bolt the axle brackets to the bed. 5 on the left and 5 on the right. It takes four 1 1/4" screws to bolt the aluminum tongue housing to the two bed slats. Two 1 3/4" screws hold on steel clamp securing the tongue at the front of the bed. Hope that helps.

Roger

jfo137
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Re: New Hand Cart questions

Post by jfo137 » Wed May 07, 2014 7:53 pm

Thank you, that was exactly what I was looking for!


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