1944 Ford GPW-231738 - "Potshot"

If you have an unrestored WWII jeep, we would like to see pictures, and hear your comments. NO EBAY or COMMERCIAL SALES.
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Boyso
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sun Jul 10, 2016 3:22 pm

Hi Luc,

I should really stop messing with it. Before you posted, I was sure it was still too close to the flank and messed with it again.

Decided to ignore the backlash as you suggested and start counting the shim stack under the pinion.

Here I had a total of 0,036" under the pinion.

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Seemed a bit too low on the tooth? Here's with 0,031" under the pinion. Should I try to find a 0,002 pinion and go to 0,033ish?

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Also, when should I check the coast side of the gear?


I sure will owe you a beer Luc!

I won't see the jeep until next weekend, will give me time to read more on the subject and less messing around.

Also, I should note that when I take the pictures, I'm pretty much at a 3/4 angle to the ring gear and the pattern seems better in the photos than when I look at it from the front. The pattern is pretty much 1mm away from the tooth's edge. Now re-looking at the pictures, the 0,031" pattern seems kinda good.
44 GPW 231738 10/23/1944
MVPA #36162


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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:16 am

Thanks for the help again, won,t be able to work on it until Saturday but I'm eager to finish it up! :)
44 GPW 231738 10/23/1944
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sat Jul 16, 2016 5:56 am

Moved two 0,005" shims from the far side to the ring side to lower the backlash. RIght now, it is at 0,007"

I guess it's normal the pattern has also slightly moved down between the two small edge of the tooth?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt2svR5P2O8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4rGqP54wW4

PS : The creaking is from the plywood table, not the gears haha
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:08 pm

This week is my week off from work for the summer so I decided to paint my frame. Since we only have 33070 gillepsie paint here for nearly 3x the cost in the US, I had 2 gallons of TM9 Ordnance paint shade #8 to a Gee member in Vermont (Thanks again Colin!) and drove down Monday.

Also bought 100ft of 3/8" air hose (19$ vs 95$ here...) and a 3/8" regulator. No more pressure drop :)

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I used a 2k epoxy primer/sceller (only available in grey) followed with a coat of red oxide duplicolor primer and then the OD paint.

Quite happy, it has a really nice texture when shooted with the HVLP gun as opposed to the spray paint 33070 I had previously.

Should get back on the axle tomorrow, cleaning it up and getting better imprints, Marty gave me a few trick like the piece of wood to jam it and create more drag.
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MVPA #36162

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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Goranwc51 » Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:07 pm

Re: The "TIRE PRESSURE 30 LBS" markings:

The most probable reason for the tire pressure markings appearing on both the windshield AND the dashboard is that the windshield was swapped out at some time.

The practice of putting the tire pressure marking on the inside of the vehicle, on the dash or on the windshield, during WW2, was probably down to the fact that the Jeeps were driven by the same driver all (or most) of the time. The driver was responsible for the field maintenance of his vehicle, checking tire pressure, oil levels, other fluid levels, etc, 1st line maintenance basically, and he needed to be reminded.

Post war, in to the mid 1950's I think that drivers no longer did the same type of maintenance as during the war and much of it was left to the motor pool mechanics . As they were working with different classes of vehicles with different tire pressure, they started putting the "TP35/TP40/TP45/TP55" etc above each wheel so the mechanic would get it right. I have yet to the nowadays so popular use of the "TP35" markings above the wheels on any WW2 Jeep in US service. The British did mark some of theirs, very crudely, with just numbers, "22" and "28" has been seen.

Looking forward to the rest of the restoration-great to see another one saved for posterity.

Goran N

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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:34 am

That's possible that the windshield was changed during it service. I'm pretty sure it hasn't changed at least during its postwar life as the paint seems to match the rest of the tub (white, blue, rust)

I rechecked the diff today while jamming the ring gear with a piece of wood to get more drag. To my untrained eye, it looks like it could be better centered between the 2 small edges? Am I being stubborn or would it be ok as is?

Also, Marty, So Cal was asking for a coast side picture so I included it. It looks pretty much dead on the small edge nearest the center of the diff, halfway up. Probably because the coast side used to be the drive side in the front diff and it saw more use?

What would be the symptoms of that pattern on the coast side, noisier during deceleration?

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I think I may do another coat on the frame on sunday (good weather and not much humidity). I have some spots which are rougher than the rest, probably because the paint slightly dried before hitting the metal (even though I had a nice pattern when I tested it on cardboard). I used 32oz of paint inc 15% of thinner to cover the whole thing, no idea if its too much or too little. Can't see the primer so I guess it's fine.

I make a living off of doing computer generated art, so this part was really fun and the paint has no runs or defect (other than the rougher texture in certain spots)

Off to drink more beer! :)
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sat Jul 30, 2016 6:53 am

Hello Gindi,

Here in the first image, I removed one pinion shim. I think the depth is now perfect.

However, without changing backlash, I'm now at 0,009-0,010".

If I move my thinnest shim from the pinion side to the ring side, my pattern gets better (2nd image) but my backlash is now too tight, barely 0,003".

Silly question, but is it normal that my new Ron shims are slightly thicker than the original ones? Mesured an original shim and a new shim with the same caliper and it's 0,0025 off. :/

WIsh I had a 0,005" shim, it'd be perfect to drop my backlash within spec.

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All my original shims are too busted to re-use.

Also, I'm having a hard time mesuring my bearing + cup to compare the tolerances to my new ones. Any tricks?

As soon as I squeeze one side, the other moves aha.

Thanks again!
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by wo2jeeper » Sat Jul 30, 2016 8:06 am

Image

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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:12 am

Found a good shin to swap in. 0,006" of backlash

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Sorry i meant carrier shim jeeper, not pinion shim :)

EDIT : fixed image size.
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by wo2jeeper » Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:20 am

Ok, can't help then

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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by wo2jeeper » Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:21 am

Ok, can't help then with these

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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:21 am

No worries! Fixed the image sizing in my last post. I think we're right on the money!!
44 GPW 231738 10/23/1944
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sun Jul 31, 2016 5:45 am

Yeah repro parts have been my biggest frustration so far.

Even yesterday, I noticed I couldn't screw in my original spring shackles into the repro bracket. You'd think the very least quality control they could do would be to bother bolting in an original part :?

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Now for the axle, super! I just need to mesure my new bearings vs the old ones, make those adjustments and replace them all.

Also gotta order those A-779 seals I forgot.

Getting there!

Thanks again for your help, the front one won't take as long I promise !
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Sat Aug 13, 2016 1:17 pm

Sorry wasn't at the cottage last weekend due to a wedding, but now I'm back.

Moved the tub that had been sitting in the woods under a tarp for the past 2 years. As rusty as I remembered, it'll be a challenge for sure.

Now it is safely inside the garage.

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Now, I replaced all the bearings on my axle.

The pinion inner bearing went in no problem and had the same thickness than the old one. The pinion outer bearing was a tight fit, but it went in when torquing the bolt with the impact driver. Also changed both those races.

Now, I replaced also the bearings on the carrier by heating them slowly, pushing them on and letting them cool slowly. I then oiled them generously. I had mesured them and compared to the old ones and the results were pretty much dead on. It is kind of hard to get an accurate mesurments of the bearing as it's shifting when squeezing with the caliper. Any tricks?

One thing I forgot to do was to mesure the race as opposed to the old one. Now the fit is too tight.

Should I remove a few thousands of an inch in shims on both side of the ring gear or have a few thousands of an inch removed from the backside of the races by a machinist?

Thanks!
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Re: 1944 Ford GPW-231738

Post by Boyso » Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:20 pm

Sorry for my lack of activity.

In between jobs, starting at a new place in October. Also getting laser eye surgery on Tuesday.

By trying to make do on the rear diff with improper tools, I messed up both my carrier bearings when pulling.

I saw a post from echelon1 suggesting the CJ86-1 Snap On puller, so I got that and a 20T press.

Now it works great :)

I replaced one bearing carrier, I'll have to change the other one as the cage seems to be slightly deformed and I'm afraid it'll bind one of the roller. It has to be perfect.

Also in the meantime, started throwing parts at the frame for fun, it helps with the morale even though I'll have to remove the spring and the grille later :P

My screen shot of the diff patern isn't really good I'll take a better one tomorrow but it's at 0,004" of backlash right now.

Also on a sidenote, replaced the media in the sandblaster from glass beads to aluminum oxide. It's much better now! Just gotta fix up those leaky corners.

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Cheers!

EDIT : Better photos
44 GPW 231738 10/23/1944
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