MA 450S Carter Carb

1940 - 1941 BRC, MA, GP, Preproduction Prototypes. Knowledge Base NO EBAY or COMMERCIAL SALES.
Chuck Lutz
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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Chuck Lutz » Sun Jul 02, 2017 6:46 pm

Hmmm....

On page 42 of the MA manual TM 10-1103 the drawing shows a hole in the top rim of the air horn which seems to be above the Choke linkage, granted this is a flat diagram but nevertheless there seems to be a hole where the air crossover air horn fits onto the carb air horn.

However....on page 47, the drawing goes to great lengths to indicate the grooves on the top of the carb air horn as mentioned above.

I'm just along for the ride here fellas, but I seem to have heard the FLANGE on the military jeep was stamped "200". Now any carb after 70+ years can have been rebuilt multiple times, but if a carb was supposed to be a military MA version and it did not have a 200 flange that would probably indicate the air horn could be suspicious as well, could it not?

What do the Carter mechanics manuals indicate?
Chuck Lutz

GPW 17963 4/24/42 Chester, PA. USA 20113473 (USA est./Tom W.)
GPW 108552 4/17/43 Louisville, KY. USA 20371278 (DOD est./Tom W.)
Bantam T3 4582 10/29/42 USA 0173499 (est.)

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by soccergorilla » Sun Jul 02, 2017 8:38 pm

I think the common belief among the MA guys it that yes the 200 is correct and the top should be ribbed. Sean.

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Scoutpilot » Mon Jul 03, 2017 2:24 am

200 is the correct marking for the flange.
'70-'71 'A' Batt., 377th FA, 101AB
(Slicks and LOH's)(Col's LOH Pilot)
'71-72 CHARLIE TROOP,
16TH AIR CAV, 1ST AVN BDE (AEROSCOUTS)
LOW LEVEL HELL.
'46 CJ2A
'47 CJ2A
'48 CJ2A
'48 B1PW126
'69 CJ5

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wo2jeeper
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MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by wo2jeeper » Mon Jul 03, 2017 3:11 am

And the metering rod (needle) is different as is the low speed jet etc etc. The 200 mark was also on the civilian 450s. Not exclusively for the MA.
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Chuck Lutz
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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Chuck Lutz » Mon Jul 03, 2017 3:12 pm

So...the MA restorer who needs a carburetor had to assemble the following:
Flange with "200" marking. Special throttle shaft & hardware for flange
Bowl has eight patents and a pointed opening and no bump so it is the same as the 539S
Bowl Cover has the rounded style rather than the triangular gusset feature...so is may be the same as the 539S (markings any different?)
Air Horn....ribbed or smooth with a hole in it...what you choose based on your research. It too has special choke linkage.

The devil is in the details or in this instance, the internals.

Oh, and you need a vacuum distributor!
Chuck Lutz

GPW 17963 4/24/42 Chester, PA. USA 20113473 (USA est./Tom W.)
GPW 108552 4/17/43 Louisville, KY. USA 20371278 (DOD est./Tom W.)
Bantam T3 4582 10/29/42 USA 0173499 (est.)


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damar2yxr
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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by damar2yxr » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:35 am

Well I thought I had done my homework so I will delve into it more. The data provided here and the depth of detail that goes into the description is impressive. The MA is an important historical vehicle and deserves to be done right.
THIS EXCITING AND HOTLY DEBATED MA CARB, AS SEEN ON THE G503 IS AVAILABLE FOR SALE FOR THE INCREDIBALLY LOW PRICE OF $550.
Last edited by damar2yxr on Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:53 am, edited 2 times in total.
Proud father of a Marine, Navy pilot, Army dentist and a Princess. Life is good!

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damar2yxr
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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by damar2yxr » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:44 am

Proud father of a Marine, Navy pilot, Army dentist and a Princess. Life is good!

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Chuck Lutz » Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:47 pm

What is the difference between a 450S and a 450SA?
Please show a 1939-1941 Carter spec sheet, not one from 1953 or anytime AFTER the end of MA production.
I am curious if the ribs/smooth air horn feature were a part of the differences.

Just askin'.....
Chuck Lutz

GPW 17963 4/24/42 Chester, PA. USA 20113473 (USA est./Tom W.)
GPW 108552 4/17/43 Louisville, KY. USA 20371278 (DOD est./Tom W.)
Bantam T3 4582 10/29/42 USA 0173499 (est.)

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wo2jeeper
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MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by wo2jeeper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:11 pm

SA is a rebuilt one by Carter. Al start as S model, after a Carter factory rebuilt, they had this service, the A is added making it an SA. Parts can then be mixed up. I have had 450SA with 12 patent bowl indicating a late 40's rebuilt. Also had early 450s with 8 patent bowls without raised 7th patent, which bowl came back early 45 on the Carter of the Earliest CJ's 636s(A).
Last edited by wo2jeeper on Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Scoutpilot » Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:15 pm

Carter carbs went through many, many design changes. “S” is the original “System” designator. “A’”, “B”, “C”, “D” indicate a design change not always obvious to the casual observer. e.g., The change from a 636S to a 636SA involved a design change to the main nozzle.
'70-'71 'A' Batt., 377th FA, 101AB
(Slicks and LOH's)(Col's LOH Pilot)
'71-72 CHARLIE TROOP,
16TH AIR CAV, 1ST AVN BDE (AEROSCOUTS)
LOW LEVEL HELL.
'46 CJ2A
'47 CJ2A
'48 CJ2A
'48 B1PW126
'69 CJ5

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wo2jeeper
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MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by wo2jeeper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:26 pm

I read what you tell also on one post on the cj2a forum, but that is only one time I read that. Have had SA carb's in zip fit Carter boxes also in 596 and 636 models.
Last edited by wo2jeeper on Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Scoutpilot » Tue Jul 04, 2017 3:28 pm

Yep. And you’ve no doubt come across many other models, WO, YF and YS with “S”, “SA”, etc. appended to their number.
'70-'71 'A' Batt., 377th FA, 101AB
(Slicks and LOH's)(Col's LOH Pilot)
'71-72 CHARLIE TROOP,
16TH AIR CAV, 1ST AVN BDE (AEROSCOUTS)
LOW LEVEL HELL.
'46 CJ2A
'47 CJ2A
'48 CJ2A
'48 B1PW126
'69 CJ5

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wo2jeeper
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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by wo2jeeper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 11:34 pm

But not with B, C or D

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Re: MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by Scoutpilot » Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:37 am

So you only do WO’s?
'70-'71 'A' Batt., 377th FA, 101AB
(Slicks and LOH's)(Col's LOH Pilot)
'71-72 CHARLIE TROOP,
16TH AIR CAV, 1ST AVN BDE (AEROSCOUTS)
LOW LEVEL HELL.
'46 CJ2A
'47 CJ2A
'48 CJ2A
'48 B1PW126
'69 CJ5

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wo2jeeper
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MA 450S Carter Carb

Post by wo2jeeper » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:37 am

Yup, so it stays a hobby and only with NOS parts, all parts are Carter branded.

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