bantam BRC engine infos

1940 - 1941 BRC, MA, GP, Preproduction Prototypes. Knowledge Base NO EBAY or COMMERCIAL SALES.

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willy63
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bantam BRC engine infos

Post by willy63 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 2:30 am

hello guys

does bantam engine is a continental engine ? it was fited on cars or industrial use ?

i think a have one but not sure it's correct model

best wishes
willy
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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by gpwmke » Mon Jul 11, 2016 8:00 am

The Bantam jeep used a Continental engine. I believe i was a model BY 112. I believe this engine was used in Bantam cars too. Continental engines of various displacement were used in everything from stationary generators and welders and pumps to the Continental raial engines used in airplanes. Some other industrial applications were fork lifts and street sweepers. I believe the distributor on the Bantam jeep engine was mounted on top of the engine and went through the head with its gear drive , Best wishes; Leo

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by willy63 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:52 pm

on our engine distributor is on top ,in cylinder head
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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by gpwmke » Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:58 pm

That would be correct for the Bantam engine. What are the casting numbers on the side of the block? Do u have a serial number? Best wishes; Leo

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by polarroller » Mon Jul 11, 2016 9:27 pm

Bantam civilian cars did not use continental engines ..there are several variations of the 112...some can be made to work for BRCs Can you send a picture? A picture of the freeze block plugs might be diagonstic. Guess I should ask if you are selling it?
S

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by lariat » Sat Oct 01, 2016 6:51 am

Bantam BRC engine is different than all other Y112. The BRC engine is only y112 that has a intake valve that's 1.328. All other Y112 engines are smaller. They also have a square welsh plug instead of round welsh plug. As Pollar Roller says there is a lot of y112s that will fit and work for the BRC.

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by ArmySailor » Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:22 am

lariat wrote:Bantam BRC engine is different than all other Y112. The BRC engine is only y112 that has a intake valve that's 1.328. All other Y112 engines are smaller. They also have a square welsh plug instead of round welsh plug. As Pollar Roller says there is a lot of y112s that will fit and work for the BRC.
Isn't that why the Bantam version was called the BY-112?
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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by lariat » Mon Oct 17, 2016 5:13 am

Great Point

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by ArmySailor » Mon Oct 17, 2016 6:40 am

The automotive versions of industrial engines usually had some differences to give them a higher power rating and a broader, more flexible rpm range versus a stationary, industrial (forklift, etc) or ag engine. Bigger intake valves, a higher compression ratio, a different cam profile and cam timing, larger intake valves and a completely differ ignition timing map could all be a part of that potentially (3even if all of those features did not appear in a particular engine). I'd have to check, but I believe the Bantam was the only time the Y-112 was used in an automotive application. Some of the larger Continental fours were used in auto applications and that's where a more powerful engine would have come from had it been mandated ... and the extra weight of it accounted for in the Army's rather unrealistic specs. There were 124, 135, 162 ci F-Series engines by Continental but I'd have to check to be sure they were all available in 1940. The 112 was the biggest in the Y-series, with 68 and 96 ci versions smaller.
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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by Polar Roller » Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:07 pm

I've brought this up before, but, will throw it out again in hopes there is someone new, or new information about the Hercules range of engines. I think this is really worth exploring and if there are guys looking for a Duncan Rolls type project, it would be really interesting to see a Bantam pilot that "could have been" built pursuant to the original Bantam conception (f we could ever find a copy of the Probst drawings).

The original Bantam design for the jeep..the one they won the bid on and the subject of the bid drawings Probst put together for the July 22 bid opening...featured a Hercules engine. Indeed, Hercules had been working with Harold Crist all during the gestation period in his layout, (and it was the President of Hercules who called Crist to tell him they had won the bid.) Christ had specifically rejected the Ford 9N when offered as being too heavy and sluggish for the car he had in mind.

The range of Herc engines I found available in 1940 centered around the IXB series...These came in a wide range based the same block ending up with one that was merely 1 cubic inch smaller than the Willys. The Bantam specs called for an engine of 85# of torque which would have been at the very small end of the range (although I did not see a direct match in the catalog I had). Frank Fenn described it as more or less the "perfect engine" for the project. Bantam assumed that QMC would raise the weight to accommodate the bigger engine, but, they famously and inexplicably refused to do so, and emphasized apparently that the 1275 pounds was firm (according to Probst).

Bantam went to Continental for two reasons..or, two are given. 1)Continental was willing to mess with the engine and make the adjustments (bigger oil pan etc) where Hercules apparently wasn't. 2) The version of the Continental they used was the most bored out one for the block, thus they got more efficiency out of a lighter package. The Hercules had the same weight as the bored out top of the line, but was much reduced, detuned version, so, it was possible to contemplate power in the 30hp range that the smaller Bantam axles could handle. When they actually got a load of the QMC specs with the lower weight, they went to the continental but also stepped up to the heavier Studebaker axles.

I cannot help but think how things might have been different if Bantam had stuck with the Hercules. Although of course they would have had to beef things up elsewhere, if the Army really wanted more power after testing the 30 hp version, Bantam would have had an engine very easily expandable to 50 or more HP. Maybe the Herc was not quite as great as the Whippet W-O used, or maybe it was better..I leave it to the experts..but, inches is inches...and if there had been svelt 50 or 60 HP Bantams running around all through the winter and spring of 1941 with W-O not delivering until early June the pressure to get on with ordering jeeps would have been even more intense than it was.

So...Duncan, or whomever..get busy and spend three or four years of your life satisfying my curiosity and build a 1941 BRC with the big Hercules in it! How much more would it weigh?

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Re: bantam BRC engine infos

Post by Duncan Rolls » Fri Oct 21, 2016 10:29 am

Hi Bill,
It could be a possibility if someone wants to commission Duncan to build it.....
Regards,
Kim.


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