Differential Carrier Bearing Question

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by Joe Gopan » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:25 pm

And Luke, can you insert a feeler gauge between the outer edges of the races? (with both bearing caps off)? If you can you will have to add shims to "zero" clearance and add 0.008". This is after you have replaced the bad bearings and cups.
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by OldGPW » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:45 pm

I'm at about the same point as Luke is, so this thread is timely. I had someone install new bearing cones on the carrier and they insisted on putting the exact shims back into place, of course it was way too tight when I did get it squeezed into the housing. Now I have to have them pulled back off to get the old shims off, and rather than have to do it again until it's right I'd like to try John's shim advice.

I am interested in what John said about using external shims, are they special/different from the "normal" ones? Once you have the bearings on the carrier (no shims underneath) and the carrier's been adusted to the correct shim set, do they stay on the outside or are the bearings pulled off again and the correct shims then put back underneath?
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by artificer » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:55 pm

The part numbers I gave on a previous post [on this thread] can be used on the outside of the cup & moved from side to side without removing the bearing cones. It is a few years since I last did, but the only issue was that there had to be as few shims as possible & the thicker the better rather than numbers of thin shims in other words a 0.015" rather than 3 x 0.005"
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by lt.luke » Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:40 am

Thank you for all the advice. I have decided o call a couple of shops today & get some estimates on having this done.

I plan to ask about replacing the pinion bearings too. my gears seem to be well worn & still serviceable.

The question now becomes: What is going to make a shop tell me I need to replace the gears? This is something I'd prefer to avoid.

Thoughts on this new possible issue?

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by Joe Gopan » Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:18 am

Established garages usually have an older mechanic familiar with Spicer. It is also best to supply the special part numbered shim packs and seals unique to the job so that the job does not sit for days for lack of the shims or lack of a supplier that cannot supply the parts locally. As forthe bearings, the shop will use the numbers on the existing bearings and races. Ask the mechanic questions and get his opinion on not having to change the shims in the housing for the pinion. Automotive Machine Shops are a good bet. Speed shops usually have mechanics familiar with differential work.
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by lt.luke » Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:53 am

Ben Dover wrote:Established garages usually have an older mechanic familiar with Spicer. It is also best to supply the special part numbered shim packs and seals unique to the job so that the job does not sit for days for lack of the shims or lack of a supplier that cannot supply the parts locally. As forthe bearings, the shop will use the numbers on the existing bearings and races. Ask the mechanic questions and get his opinion on not having to change the shims in the housing for the pinion. Automotive Machine Shops are a good bet. Speed shops usually have mechanics familiar with differential work.
I actually just got off the phone with a gentlemen who comes recommended. he said simply press on new bearings with the existing shim thicknesses and reinstall. He said, essentially "you can do it." so I'm going to. He gave me another vote of confidence, as well as an offer of phone assistance if I needed it.

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by lt.luke » Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:59 am

What size and tpe of press is necessary for this job (both pinion and carrier bearings?) Is a hand arbor press sufficient, or is something more robust needed?

On Harbor Freight, a 1-ton Arbor Press is about $45, and the machine shop will charge no more than $75 to press off, then back on the bearings for me. I'm doing the math, and looking at the long term and the smarter money seems to be on buying the press. A 6-ton A Frame is $65 and still potentially less than farming ou the pressing job.

What say? buy a press and do the whole thing, or farm out the pressing job?

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by Joe Gopan » Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:23 am

The Harbor Freight Press may not be sufficient.
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by lt.luke » Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:28 am

Ben Dover wrote:The Harbor Freight Press may not be sufficient.
Ok.

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by OldGPW » Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:49 am

artificer wrote:The part numbers I gave on a previous post [on this thread] can be used on the outside of the cup & moved from side to side without removing the bearing cones. It is a few years since I last did, but the only issue was that there had to be as few shims as possible & the thicker the better rather than numbers of thin shims in other words a 0.015" rather than 3 x 0.005"
Thanks John! 8)

And Thanks Luke for starting this thread! 8)
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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by lt.luke » Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:55 am

OldGPW wrote:
artificer wrote:The part numbers I gave on a previous post [on this thread] can be used on the outside of the cup & moved from side to side without removing the bearing cones. It is a few years since I last did, but the only issue was that there had to be as few shims as possible & the thicker the better rather than numbers of thin shims in other words a 0.015" rather than 3 x 0.005"
Thanks John! 8)

And Thanks Luke for starting this thread! 8)
No worries!

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Re: Differential Carrier Bearing Question

Post by JAB » Mon Jan 09, 2012 2:11 pm

Ben Dover wrote:I have done it by Willys (Spicer) procedure for over half a century, and still have the ordnance and factory tools on hand plus a stock of bearings, Spicer brand shim packs, and NOS Military and CJ differential Ring and Pinions etc. on hand just in case the need arises to do another. I am pretty good at it too.
Me too, but for "only" 30 years or so, & with the CJ factory tool kit, although I'm always on the lookout for the tools pictured in the back of the MB/GPW manuals for this job. I think it would be "fun" to try it the old way.

BTW, if it helps simplify things, moving a 0.005" shim from one side of the carrier to the other nets approx. 0.003" change in backlash. Naturally this formula works best when you've already set the pre-load. CJ's, starting with the 2A mention 0.020" pre-load so the 0.008" that Joel mentioned should make the job a little easier without the carrier spreader.
-Jeff

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