Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Manufacturers, production numbers, configurations, etc.
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Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Emmanuel » Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:18 pm

Hello, I've found last weekend the jerry can in the pictures. On the can there isn't any sign of a makers name besides a single R between the more common ICC-5 and 20 51/4 43 notification on the underside.

I've searched the forum but wasn't able to find a manufacturer who used the letter R.

Does someone know who made this can?

Thank you in advance,
Paul
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by gerrykan » Tue Jan 03, 2017 1:45 pm

Emmanuel,
Your can was manufactured in England by the British Firm Magnatex on machinery sent from the USA.
Roy

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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Emmanuel » Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:39 pm

Roy,
Thank you very much for the information. I had never heard about the Firm Magnatex.
I found some information on the forum but I wondered where the R stands for.
As I understand the cans were also stamped with a M which makes more sense with the name Magnatex.

Do you know were the R comes from?

While searching about the firm Magnatex some members wrote that they only have seen water cans made them, is this then the first gas can with these markings on the forum.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by bombtech » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:46 pm

Emmanual,
I have very little in the way of research on Magnatex, however my data base indicates both 42 and 43 for gasoline cans, and 43 for water. In my two pages of notes, I mention to only have seen the water version myself. I have included my notes below for your ease. I must advise that they are raw personal notes not intended for publication without further research and confirmation of facts or suppositions. Should you learn more I would be quite interested.
Cheers,
Rick

MAGNATEX

The following two pages m/l are excerpts from the G503 jerry can forum and old car web sites reference the Magnatex jerricans, both Water and gasoline. As of this writing, July 2013, I have only seen the water version in person.

Magnatex Limited, operated a 5-gallon blitz-can plant shipped to England by the War Department. It turned out between; November1, 1943 and August 31, 1945 some 2,258,944 American style Blitz cans. Possibly the Magnatex factory was located in Hillingdon, Hayes, near Heathrow it may be the Hotel Ibis or one of the many housing developments built at the intersection of Oxford Avenue and Bath Road.
Magnatex might be the firm in the Midland-Odessa area that made oil-field equipment.

Did Magnatex make cans here in the USA before this factory went to the UK? unkn

Did Magnatex still produce cans here in the USA on other machinery? unkn

What dates are found on Magnatex cans? So far only;
U.S.W.
M (in a circle) 42

Were 42 Water Cans made in the USA BEFORE the plant was shipped to UK? unkn

Did factory in England use the EARLY dished lid or the later flat lid?

Did they make gas cans there and what markings are on them? The identifier on gasoline cans is a very light stamping, of M in circle, that can easily be missed if it has been covered by a heavy coat of paint.

Ray Cowdery in Army Motors#53 strongly objected to an article by Richard M.Daniel, originally published on American Heritage of Invention & Technology and reprinted on Army Motors#51. According to Daniel, the Americans got three German cans, smuggled by the American engineer Paul Plessie. In 1940, at Camp Holabird the sample German can was poorly redesigned, the article goes on, almost resembling fiction.
According to Cowdery, the Americans received captured German cans for evaluation from the British in summer 1940. The Americans adapted the design to the American industrial methods. [As a matter of fact we know that the standard USA QMC cans, Gas or Water, had a 1941 date.] Cowdery also reminded the readers that the U.S. Army produced some 2,528,944 cans at an U.S. Army owned plant in Great Britain, operated by Magnatex.
Additionally how very shortly after the D-Day landings, a severe shortage of U.S. 5 gallon fuel cans developed, throughout allied units in Europe. The shortage was cured by the shipment of millions of British jerrycans... [As a matter of fact, British cans are by far the most common in Europe!].

To quote an excerpt from a book published in 1953 by the US Government, concerning the QMC history during WWII:
"The blitz can was an adaptation to American usage of the 5-gallon German can, or 'Jerry Can', a sample of which was brought to the Office of the Quarter Master General in the summer of 1940. The Motor Transport Division instructed the Holabird Quartermaster Motor Base to prepare specifications for a 5-gallon galvanized can following generally the pattern of those captured from the Germans in Europe."

The Gov't usage of the term "captured" seems more likely they received the sample(s) from the British. The US can having the X reinforcement while the British used the Italian/late German reinforcement actually (in my opinion) translates to British supplied samples. To explain; if You(England) possessed a few cans of both designs, wouldn't you keep the latest style for yourself, and send the earlier type to your allies?

Unfortunately the text reveals few clues, and one problem is that blitz can, 5-gallon can, drum, and container seem to be used somewhat interchangeably.

I find no other reference to substantiate the following from G503:

On certain parts of jerrycan, one finds the inscriptions TEX... (which would undoubtedly mean that these cans were assembled in a factory of the American army located in the United Kingdom: Magnatex Limited).
The US cans are lighter in weight. 10 lbs empty/44 full. Compared to a Brit/German can at 11.5/44lbs.

http://www.jag-lovers.org/xk-lovers/lib ... lamps.html
My experience suggests there is growing awareness that CHENEY brand hose-clamps were correct original equipment for XKs. What appears to be less well known is that earlier XK120s at least did not use CHENEY clamps but did use "TEX" brand. Students of the various factory literature will be aware that this is not readily apparent, as where brand is identified they are called "GRIPTITE", with size shown as 15, 20, 25, 30, 35, which appears to relate to the median suitable hose diameter, where 25 equals 2.5 inches diameter. GRIPTITE is only a trade name, shown only on some of the larger size clamps as "GRIPTITE PATENTED", but they were made by "Magnatex Ltd., London", and thus the very prominent "TEX" on the adjusting screw housing. Anyway, the point of this background is to discover when were TEX hose clamps superseded by the later CHENEY clamps on XK120s. My research to date suggests TEX were still exclusively used in 1951, so any comments from researchers/owners of ORIGINAL cars would be welcome. Obviously top radiator hoses were commonly replaced on even low mileage original cars, so careful comments please. - Roger Payne

More definate than "supposedly". The TEX clamps have "Magnatex Ltd. LONDON MADE IN ENGLAND" stamped on band, alongside "GRIPTITE Patented" (this is name referred to in parts books) and large "TEX" on adjusting screw housing, which as advised by Jamie is a quick release arrangement. The smaller sizes dont seem to have the "GRIPTITE" stamping; no room? - Roger Payne

http://freespirit1.homestead.com/col-uk.html
Magna Fumalux battery operated torch & slide open fluid flint-less lighter, 58mm high. Made by/?? licensed to Magnatex Ltd., Bath Rd., Harlington, Middx. as a German patent for an identical lighter (model FL400) was patented by Fumalux of Karlsruhe on 12-11-1955. Magnatex also produced Casco Tex car cigarette lighters & motor car equipment.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/gds/COLLECTING-BU ... 062/g.html
I DOUBT YOULL EVER BE LUCKY ENOUGH to see a set[never mind own one] of THE TEX DARTS made by magnatex bath road harlington middlesex in the 1950s.box reads finished in 8 beautiful colours streamlined in resilient plastic. What makes these unique. Unscrew the flights and the weighted points lift out and you turn them upside down and store the points in hollow flights/barrels and screw them back on. You could then put these in your shirt pocket safely without a case, amazing.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Sat Jan 07, 2017 2:17 am

A few facts on Magnatex production on this link but no pictures of markings.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=240360&p=1407507#p1407507
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Sat Jan 07, 2017 11:15 am

I am still not convinced by any of the Markings said to be Magnatex. Magnatex LTD only assembled Blanks that had been pressed out in the States by some other manufacturer. The original US manufacturer also supplied the assembly equipment.

Magnatex LTD would not of been assembling any cans in 1942.

Magnatex LTD used US made closures in the early stages and started producing their own from sometime after 24th January 1944.

Not all the blanks were used and some unknown quantity were returned to the States.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by bombtech » Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:05 am

Sillys MB,
Do you know of the date the two documents you reference and included in the above response? As they appear to be a summery of events from a third party. My reason for asking is that although I agree that assembling cans in the UK on the USA machines in 1942 is improbable, I'm not sure it was impossible, given the urgency of the mission? Furthermore, perhaps the 'blanks' were pressed in the US during 1942 (as some are dated), then shipped to UK, then assembled in '43 or even later. I agree with your statement that NO definitive link between the Magnatex company and the jerry cans they assembled has yet come to light, (unlike RUSSAKOV who stampped some of their cans "assembled by RUSSAKOV". I think that with all that you have generously provided in the way of text documents and photographs, it clearly substantiates that Magnatex did in fact assemble cans. I would also suggest that either or both of the lightly stamped symbols of "M in circle" or R" may have been added by Magnatex during the assembly process, but again I have NO proof to date. I will continue to search for more information, and would be grateful for anything else you can add to the puzzle.
Cheers,
Rick
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:48 am

Hi Rick,
Sorry it was a bit of a short answer yesterday , I was a bit short of time.

I have put some more information on this thread to keep it all together viewtopic.php?f=37&t=240360&p=1637987#p1637987.

The first month of production assembly is given as July 1943. I agree that the blanks could of been pressed and dated in 1942 in the US but no evidence of the manufacturer of the blanks is around as far as I know.

Tex is the most likely marking as it was registered as a trademark in October 1944 to Magnatex.

I will keep digging. :D
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Sun Jan 08, 2017 1:13 pm

Phillipe Leger states that it could be marked with a Letter R on the base and Tex on the handle but has no pictures on the website.

http://philippeleger5.wixsite.com/jerry ... icants-usa

I would suggest to Emmanual that he has a good look on the handle, I would love to see a picture :)
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Chuck Lutz » Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:14 am

Rick:
Here is a 1942 Circle M Vented WATER can with the dished lid:
Magnatex 1942 Water Handle.jpg
Magnatex 1942 Water Handle.jpg (100.89 KiB) Viewed 3626 times
The "R" can above is dated "43". It has a screw top, not the dished style seen on other Circle M cans we have seen. AFAIK, none of those cans have been reported to have anything stamped on the bottom. I see the top was attached to the sides as US cans are (and Ford GPW hood front edge seems are) which is definitely something I doubt the Brits had available for making containers.

The Circle M can pics I have are all the dished lid style and have the vent the US cans have (three of them) and this one above has a "G" which would indicate GASOLINE as opposed to W for WATER.

The Circle M cans (and this one above) USUALLY have the handles spot welded to the top but one is stick welded.

The can above has a recessed strengthening ridge in the bottom between the marking and the seam and that is a feature I have not seen on any USA made cans so that is interesting also.

So what gives?
1) a complete plant was sent to the UK
2) the plant used Brit steel "blanks"
3) the plant used USA steel "blanks"
4) the plant ASSEMBLED the bottom, side, top and handle which were all stamped out in the USA and shipped as components to the UK and then assembled there.

I would think the most LOGICAL explanation would be a combination of #1 and #3 since the whole point of the exercise would be to cut down on wasted shipping space and an inability of the British to make enough weapons of war. If they needed ore, smelters, stampers, etc. to even MAKE the steel, it probably came in sheets from the USA. Piece of cake....just send the factory and then send steel sheet "blanks" and they could stamp 'em out.

The #4 just wastes shipping space right in the middle of the Uboat war....so I'm not sure that was a viable method.

Hey, they sent a jerry can factory to the Middle East, right?
Chuck Lutz

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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:48 am

Chuck Lutz wrote:Rick:



So what gives?
1) a complete plant was sent to the UK
2) the plant used Brit steel "blanks"
3) the plant used USA steel "blanks"
4) the plant ASSEMBLED the bottom, side, top and handle which were all stamped out in the USA and shipped as components to the UK and then assembled there.

I would think the most LOGICAL explanation would be a combination of #1 and #3 since the whole point of the exercise would be to cut down on wasted shipping space and an inability of the British to make enough weapons of war. If they needed ore, smelters, stampers, etc. to even MAKE the steel, it probably came in sheets from the USA. Piece of cake....just send the factory and then send steel sheet "blanks" and they could stamp 'em out.

The #4 just wastes shipping space right in the middle of the Uboat war....so I'm not sure that was a viable method.

Hey, they sent a jerry can factory to the Middle East, right?
A pretty good summary is here Chuck, viewtopic.php?f=37&t=240360&p=1638007#p1638007 , scroll up for pictures of the actual plant and blanks packaged up and sent from the US.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Emmanuel » Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:29 pm

Hi all, I wasn't able to look at the forum this weekend so I was overwhelmed of the information you guys have gathered so far. After reading everything what was written I went searching for other markings on the gas can. At first I couldn't find any but with some patient I found faintly the name TEX under the dirt and rust on the right front side of the handle.

The text TEX is very lightly stamped and hopefully the picture is clear enough to see it. (I've marked it with the red arrow) There isn't anything stamped on the top.

Chuck saw it correct that the can has a recessed strengthening ridge. This is feature I also have never seen before. A friend of mine told me that he has several unmarked dated gas cans. I have to ask if these also have the recessed strengthening ridge. It is possible that you can't see the R or M markings under several layers of paint but the strengthened underside is very noticeable.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Silly's MB » Mon Jan 09, 2017 2:12 pm

Thanks for posting the picture Emmanuel, It is the first time I have seen a picture showing the 'Tex' Marking. :D

I think it is time to re-think who the Circle M manufacturer is on the 1942 cans.

I have found a route to some other information on Magnatex but it may not produce anything or be prohibitively expensive.
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by bombtech » Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:18 pm

WOW!! That is a great find of the "TEX" stamping, many thanks Emmanuel
Chuck, appreciate your photo as well, that 'circle M' is hard to miss now that I've seen a nice one
Silly's MB, Once again I am in agreement, if TEX is for Magnatex, then who is 'circle M'???
DO any of you have one of the hose clamps with the TEX marks as mentioned by the Jaguar club member? might be nice to compare the font and style with the jerry can marks?
Based on the difference in the method of stamping, I would suggest that the 'circle M' maker stamped the parts and may have assembled them as well. In contrast it looks as if the 'R' was stamped subsequent to the initial stamping of the base piece, similar to the TEX stamp.
DO cans with the R stamp also have the TEX stamp? and vice versa?
Do cans with the circle M have either R or TEX?
Point being are we trying to sort one, two or even three stamping companies and or assembly companies?
Since I have none of these models I must defer to those collectors with a more substantial inventory.

I have also seen reference to a jerry can "manufacture" located in Kidderminster, England, possibly Brintons Carpet Works. So far I can make no correlation between that entity and any marked English pattern cans. Any thoughts on whether they may be the 'circle M' ?, Any clarity would be most appreciated.
Cheers to all on the hunt for jerry can enlightenment.
Rick
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Re: Manufacturer I.D. U.S. Jerry can

Post by Robin » Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:08 pm

I thought that recessed rectangle on the bottom of that can looked familiar so I checked my collection. Bennett 42 gas can has the same rectangle. But their 43, 44, and 45 cans don't.
Image
41 M3 37mm A/T gun
42 M1A1 75mm pack how
43 MBT trailer
43 WC52
43 WC62
44 Chevy 1.5 ton
44 MZ2 USMC radio Jeep
44 RL35 reel cart
44 K38 trailer
43 K52 trailer
43 M3A4 handcarts(8)
M1942 USMC handcart
M1917 Litter Carrier
M1917 Ammo cart
43 Columbia bike


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