Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

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Austringer
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Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by Austringer » Mon May 09, 2016 6:50 am

Just picked this M6 37mm Breech as used in the M8 Armored Car, M3 & M5 series of light tanks as well as a few other vehicles. It will need some cosmetic work, mainly just building up the top lips of the breech end. nothing structural or critical stress area was damaged. Think they did it this way so that it would only look demiled. Will be going into the glass bead cabinet when it arrives. :-)

Now, I just need to get one of the vehicle mentioned above. :-)

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Jason Green
Atlanta, Ga

STILL NOT associated with the Georgia MVPA 15 years and counting as long as that one guy is president of the club....

1963 Willys M151 (under resto)
1969 M706E1
1983 M106A2


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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by DDTrustee » Mon May 09, 2016 7:36 am

Looks nice - need block and breech handle?
Didn't know you had an M8
reenacting and WWII history

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Austringer
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by Austringer » Mon May 09, 2016 7:45 am

I need everything for it! Block, etc.
I'm having a good friend of mine fix the cosmetic issue of the rear. I don't have an M8, but I'll have a block if I do get one. :-)
Jason Green
Atlanta, Ga

STILL NOT associated with the Georgia MVPA 15 years and counting as long as that one guy is president of the club....

1963 Willys M151 (under resto)
1969 M706E1
1983 M106A2

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dpcd67
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by dpcd67 » Sat May 14, 2016 7:22 am

You do realize that you are in possession of a Destructive Device, and needs to have registration papers? There are Fed agents who troll these web sites looking for innocent people to nab. I know this to be a fact.
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Austringer
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by Austringer » Sat May 14, 2016 7:35 am

When did the laws change?
Jason Green
Atlanta, Ga

STILL NOT associated with the Georgia MVPA 15 years and counting as long as that one guy is president of the club....

1963 Willys M151 (under resto)
1969 M706E1
1983 M106A2

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by dpcd67 » Sat May 14, 2016 12:05 pm

It appears from the pics that you are in possession of a functional, breech ring from a breech loading artillery piece. As such, it cannot be possessed or transferred without registration, which cannot be done now. So, the laws have always been this way since 1934. I am just trying to help you avoid what will be very unpleasant should an enthusiastic ATF agent see your posting. Like I said, I know for a fact that they troll the Web looking for this. Now, if your breech ring has been correctly de-milled, which means it has to be cut into 4 pieces, then you are ok, But it looks like you have a whole breech ring. There are lots of artillery pieces out there that have been stolen from ranges, and stolen/bought from small towns, and VFWs, that are absolutely not legal to privately own. I have seen them. I also know that the ATF, and TACOM take a dim view of this. Just trying to help you not get into trouble. I just took the shadows out of your pics; this breech definitely is not legal to own, unless you have the tax stamp.
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by Austringer » Sat May 14, 2016 12:30 pm

I appreciate your concern and thoughtfulness in this regard but I'm going to disagree with you regarding its legal nature. Also, it did not come from a towed gun, was removed from salvaged M8 greyhound. If you come across any 57mm, 75/76mm or 37mm breechs, i would be more than happy to take them off your hands at no chargextra and take on all legal liability for their possession. If a barrel is present as well, I would leave that with you and purchase later once the form is returned.

Thanks again
Jason
404 665 6411
Jason Green
Atlanta, Ga

STILL NOT associated with the Georgia MVPA 15 years and counting as long as that one guy is president of the club....

1963 Willys M151 (under resto)
1969 M706E1
1983 M106A2

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by dpcd67 » Sat May 14, 2016 2:13 pm

You are right; as long as you do not also possess a barrel over 50 caliber that fits the ring.
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by Austringer » Sat May 14, 2016 3:22 pm

That's correct, as long as you do not have both the barrel and breech in in your possession the breech is considered a title 1 firearm, just like a rifle. A barrel by itself is nothing. Im just tired of people freaking out thinking that the breech by itself is a destructive device and then spending many posts trying to point out their error. A 40mm bofors breech, that's a different story as I've never been able to get the BATF to tell me which part is considered the machine gun receiver. Lol.
Jason Green
Atlanta, Ga

STILL NOT associated with the Georgia MVPA 15 years and counting as long as that one guy is president of the club....

1963 Willys M151 (under resto)
1969 M706E1
1983 M106A2

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by napavalleyartillery » Sat May 14, 2016 7:53 pm

A few years back ATFE's position on the 40mm Bofors was that the ring is the controlled part. I have a diagram showing the cut ring.
Assuming that remains the rule, keep firmly in mind that the loose ring, while not a destructive device, IS A MACHINE GUN. Thus best not be found with an uncut ring.
The cut is vertical on both sides in the area where the block slides, which cuts the ring into two pieces.
It is permissible to possess the front portion as a means to retain the barrel in the housing of a display unit. (As it would be permissible to have the front half of the M-6 ring, together with the barrel, since the ring is effectively destroyed.)
The more interesting issue is if you can possess both parts of the cut ring along with the barrel. With regard to a regular DD, maybe yes. The cannons in many of the british tanks imported some years ago had the cutoff rear portion of the ring with them. (Along with, of course, the good barrel and the front half of the ring.)
On the other hand, the 40 Bofors ring is a machine gun, and ATFE has often required that part of the cut controlled part of a machine gun not be possessed. So probably don't possess the rear section if you have the front part to hold the barrel in place.
It is very good practice to be very conservative in the interpretation of ATFE rules. The rules (and penalties) are not to be scoffed at or ignored.
YMMV

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by W. Winget » Mon May 16, 2016 6:11 am

I have never read such BS Barracks Lawyer stuff in all the time reading posts. You have to wonder how many of these guys actually ever owned DD's.

Read the rules on the BATF site (better yet, in the annual regulations pubs )VS. posting dribble warnings of the sky falling everytime it's brought up.

Your fine and legal with just the 37, 57, 105mm, etc. breechring (and parts) in your possession, if you desire to get a barrel, and or assemble a gun, register the ring and THEN put a barrel to it, bottom don't have both pieces in your possession (or your relatives) without obtaining the $200 BATF tax stamp for a DD.

Yes, 40mm AA guns have a frame that is considered a breechring by ATF but that's a different beast. SO ARE MACHINEGUNS and their rules, they are not the same as DDs.

Torch marks on the top lips were likely where the breechblock was welded in and cut back out when a previous owner came to possess it. Common way of rendering a display piece inactive, it does not mean it was a monument gun either...so the posters on 'stolen monuments' and the government hunting you down can chill out on their posts as well.

Nice piece, hope you find the remainder of the vehicle to go around it. Missed a complete M6 at Aberdeen a few years back that went for around $1500, my friend with an M8 sat at the booth and did not walk around, kicks himself everyday for that fail.
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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by nirvana » Mon May 16, 2016 9:05 am

I love internet legal advice on title ii weapons. Most of the time its posted by people who believe that you need a "class 3 license" to own stuff, and have no idea what a Form 1, Form 4, or Form 5 are. A tax stamp, CLEO sign off, fingerprint cards? Never heard of them. Demil standards are a total mystery, and registration doesn't exist, at least not after 1934 or 1968 (which depends on the weapon type and circumstances). This piece is obviously fine.

How far does that flame cutting go down into the ring, top to bottom? It looks pretty deep in the photos, a few inches perhaps. I can't tell if its a load bearing spot, or just the top.

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by napavalleyartillery » Mon May 16, 2016 11:20 am

Well if I offended anyone I'm certainly sorry. It was not my intent. Would have thought it was clear most of my discussion was directed toward the 40 Bofors, in response to the previous poster's implied question, not the OP's single shot DD.
For what it's worth, ATFE has gone both ways on whether it is the housing or the breech ring that is the controlled part in the 40 Bofors.. Last I heard, directly from them a few years ago, it is the ring.
Again, I apologize.

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Re: Just picked up M6 37mm Breech

Post by nirvana » Mon May 16, 2016 12:35 pm

On the Bofors, it is the ring, for whatever reason. The housings for the guns are surprisingly common, which is again puzzling. Unless someone made new rings, I would guess all of the transferable guns are pre-1968 amnesty pieces. I'm not aware of new rings...

But yea, I agree on the Bofors.


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