24087 new info...no, really...might have the answer

[Joe Gopan]

GI Issue Rust Inhibiting 24087 with some fading will mimic 2430. If you could have been present when the M-38 and also the M-38A1 when they were factory new or kept under cover as many Guard units did, you would see a very pleasant 2430 color that gave a hint of brown.

[Schultzd]

Ben - Go back and look at my posting, my original paint in NO WAY mimics 2430, it is exactly like 24087.

[Joe Gopan]

And 2430 was the factory OEM paint for the M-38 and M-38A1 Jeeps. The first use of 24087 at Jeep was during 1967 on the M-715 series trucks.
Joe Friday was kind enough to share some good factory documentation on the topic on M-38 paint information a few years back. It put a lot of speculation to rest. Jim Gilmore also contributed a lot on the 2430 M-38 topic.

[Tom Wolboldt]

Hi Ben,

The first use of 24087 at Jeep was during 1967 on the M-715 series trucks.

What is the document source for the above statement ? I know of several researchers that would like to add that verified data to their records.

[Joe Gopan]

The great Joe Friday.!!!!!
It also mentioned the use of it on the 801762 M-38 Wheel if I remember correctly. Do a search using 801762, see if it comes up.

[Tom Wolboldt]

Thanks!

[Joe Gopan]

You're welcome, I soak up M-38/M-38A1 information like a sponge, Joe's posts about 2430 on M-38 and M-38A1 supplied a missing link to that pleasant brownish look of new M-38 and M-38A1 Jeeps that I had witnessed at the local National Guard units and a few that had original paint during the early 60's that I witnessed in the Army. I could never figure it out until Joe posted the factory information.
The long time advisor to the Army Guard was my next door neighbor during the 50's-60's, and there was an M-37 or M-38 parked in his yard often during the 50's when they were taking delivery.

[Schultzd]

Ben - You are not understanding. THERE IS NO 2430 on my late 1952 M38, the original paint on the under side matches 24087 exactly. Please explain.

Dan

[Joe Gopan]

Let's see if ewe can figure this out with a few simple questions. Are you positive that the paint sample that matches the "24087" on your Jeep is genuine 24087? Where did you get the 24087 that matches your Jeep.

[Joe Gopan]

Here's an example where looks can be deceiving. These photos of my M-38A1 were taken Sept 2012 after having just been repainted. The paint is GI Issue Rust inhibiting Olive Drab 24087 manufactured in 1963 by Atlas Paint. I had just repainted the Jeep as the GI Issue paint last applied in May 1997 had started to fade after 15 years. The entire body was repainted except for the dash.
Note the lower photo, the paint on the dash is the same faded Atlas 24087 paint that was on the body a few days earlier, compare the difference in the color of the dash which was painted in 1997, to the body and windshield repainted 2012. Next take a look at the plate for the instruments, it is the original 2430 factory paint and is NOS M-170 from 1950s packaged Willys parts.

[TacticalTruck]

I was told once that during the paint number mix up 24085 became the older 24087. I had some 24085 and it seemed to match the "greener" semi-gloss. Any one else heard this?

[Cuz]

Joel's photo of his dash is one of the best comparisons I have ever seen with the two paints side by side, in the same lighting, on the same jeep, on the same date and in the same photo. It doesn't get any better than this. Thank you Joel for that outstanding photo! Below I took the liberty of editing it a bit.



Joe Friday or Keith Buckley posted the paint info from the hundreds of Willys drawings he has back in 2003. Here's a copy:

Keith Buckley G-Command Sergeant Major Joined: 03 Jan 2003 Posts: 219
Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2003 7:30 pm Post subject:
Quote:
Enamel:
Military Spec MIL-E-11857, Color Spec TT-E-595, NO.2430 or optional No.2430 applied
after final chassis assembly.

finish for 801762 was later changed to "paint per instruction dwg 957085-B" on
9/22/61.

I can't speak for the Combat wheels. Every archive I've been to the info was missing.
Might have been the old "confidential war item" category. All our tire mold and
bulletproof tube dwgs are that way.

I tried to scan the 2430, but it came out black. 2430 is lighter than 24087.


There is no difference between x-24087 and 24087, and there is and was only ONE
shade of 24087. I suspect you were comparing the lighter 2430 to the darker 24087.

If the wheels you were looking at were manufactured after 3/1/62, I suspect they were
640800 wheels. They look the same, but have no safety hump and have a 3/4 inch
offset instead of 3/8.

So...

Summary -
801762 thru 9/22/61 was 2430, then changed to 24087 MC, 3/8 offset with safeety
hump
929499 was 24087 MD, MDA 3/8 offset with safety hump
640800 was civilian colors or 24087 no safety hump

As for the M715,,, the M715 and the XM715 were standard 24087. There was only one.

[Joe Gopan]

Thank you Cuz.
Cuz was instrumental is clearing up the 24087 v/s 2430 color controversy on M-38/M-38A1, his efforts resulted in Keith Buckley, Jeep Factory Drawing specialist, posting the Willys factory paint details on how the M-38/M-38A1 and its' components were originally painted at the factory.
Note the slightly darker appearance of the windshield, A factory new windshield has just been installed during the 2012 repaint and only has two coats of GI Atlas 24087 over the thin factory paint. There can be a difference in paint texture when the sheet metal is factory new.

[Joe Friday]

I appreciate the good words guys, but the data posted above from 2003 was specific to the data obtained from the Engineered drawing for the M38 wheel 801762.
In the last 11 years we have located the pages specific to body and chassis paint for the M38/M38 vehicles.

In short, we now have both Willys and Kaiser paint records from the MC and MD Bill of Materials for Group 315, Paint
It appears all M38's were 2430 or Strata Blue from the factory, and it has dates specific to each version of M38A1 by contract and branch of service.
It does appear that X24087 was introduced Willys Part number 959591.

I don't have the time right now to go thru the 200 pages or so to condense the information into a simple post

[Joe Gopan]

One thing to note is that the GI Issue 24087 was a rust inhibiting enamel and had Red Oxide Primer as one of the ingredients.