SU carburator on jeep

1941 - 1945, MB, GPW modifications, sugestions, and ideas, official MWO's and unofficial WWII field mods NO EBAY or COMMERCIAL SALES.
Wolfman
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Wolfman » Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:40 am

Update:
After my last post, I did a search for the Ford flat head V-8 Hemi conversion.
Found a whole lot of intel.
One video was of a flat head engine running with one head removed. :shock:
Look it up.
You want to see how fast things really happen in your jeep engine. This will show you.
Not like what you see turning your engine over with an end wrench !!
Mike Wolford
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AOPA ( 50 yrs)
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Marty, SoCal
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Marty, SoCal » Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:57 am

You can still buy the "Ardun" hemi head conversion kit for the Ford flathead V8, new production, not cheap at $14,000!

http://ardun.com/

Image

Image

Getting back to the Willys, how about adding a small turbo to the engine with a throttle body type injection setup on the inlet side of the turbo, should eliminate mixture issues.

My daughter has an '89 Nissan Sentra with a one barrel throttle body EFI. Looking at it most of the sensors are in the throttle body unit itself. It has the crank sensor in the distributor, which I believe rotates counterclockwise like the Willys. The other external sensors are the O2 sensor, a coolant temp sensor and what Nissan calls a power transistor (ignition module) mounted on the ignition coil. Brainstorming it might only take some mods to lengthen the shaft in the distributor and welding a properly sized aluminum base to the body to make it fit the block and an adapter plate to fit it to the stock intake manifold.

Also, it might be easier to multipoint a "F" head Willys, by putting injector bungs into the cylinder head right above each intake valve opening.
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Wolfman
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Wolfman » Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:56 am

Food for thought !

The over head cam, in line 6 "Tornado" engine used by Willys is a Hemi head engine.

8)
Mike Wolford
CJ-2A
VEP GPW
Comm./Inst. SEL
AOPA ( 50 yrs)
EAA ( 49 yrs)
4th Inf. Div. - 5th Inf. Div. - 2nd Armor Div. - CIB

Marty, SoCal
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Marty, SoCal » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:27 am

Yes! An adaption of the Kaiser flathead six!
43 Ford GPW 92098
53 Dunbar Kapple M100
Sold: 61 CJ-5, 41 T207 WC-1 Dodge closed cab pickup
MVPA #8266
USMC Tanker (1811, 1812), 85-93
ASE Automotive Master tech, former Chrysler-Jeep Level 4 Mastertech, CA state EA smog license

Wolfman
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Wolfman » Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:32 am

I have a couple of the Tornado engines locally that I have worked on. One in a J-200 pick up that I rebuilt and another in an M-715.
They seem to have a problem with the rocker arm guides breaking. The long timing chain looks a bit lanky, but have not had any problem with it.
Other than that, their performance and power is pretty impressive. More like a V-8. And a whole lot of torque.
Mike Wolford
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VEP GPW
Comm./Inst. SEL
AOPA ( 50 yrs)
EAA ( 49 yrs)
4th Inf. Div. - 5th Inf. Div. - 2nd Armor Div. - CIB

bazza46
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by bazza46 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:37 pm

You could get most power by fitting a turbocharger. A larger carburettor could be fitted at the front, as in the '30s supercharged Austins and Bentleys, thus avoiding the complexity of fuel injection. You could get a massive increase in power with a modest boost, at least as much as the L134 could take without blowing up. The inefficient side valve port design wouldn't be a problem, when the fuel mixture is being force fed into the engine
You wouldn't have to fit one of the giant turbos you see in street racers, There are plenty of very small ones (look at Volkswagen's for instance.)
And with the intake and exhaust ports on the same side, you wouldn't have to construct the complicated piping from the turbo to the intakes.
No need for an intercooler, as you're not trying for 200 BHP/Litre.
Bazza
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"..Bertrand Russell

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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Wolfman » Wed Apr 25, 2018 6:28 am

Volumetric efficiency. That is what the people that taught me called it, Bazza.
Going to keep this real simple.
When the piston is at TDC, the pressure in the cylinder and the atmospheric pressure outside are equal.
When the piston starts down, on the intake stroke, the pressure in the cylinder drops because the cylinder volume is increasing, so atmospheric pressure outside pushes air into the cylinder, through the intake valve port, in an attemp to again equalize the pressure inside, by filling the cylinder with the correct volume of air.
By the time the piston reaches BDC, the cylinder volume has reached it's maximum volume. The air outside is still rushing in, trying to bring the pressure inside back to equal pressure. Of course , by the time the piston starts back up, on the compression stroke, show is over. The intake valve closes and the big squeeze is on.
The percentage of the volume of air inside the cylinder, at BDC, in relation to the actual volume of the cylinder, expressed in percentage, is volumetric effieciency.
Enter the time factor. At low speed, there is more time for the outside air to fill the expanded cylinder volume. percentage is up, but as engine speed increases there is less time for nature to act, so the effiiency percentage drops.
Enter the turbo charger. Help nature out. Increasing intake manifold pressure helps fill the cylinder with the correct volume of air at higher speeds.
for street use, it is a balancing act. You just want to "normalize" cylinder pressure at higher engine speeds. Too little boost and you are wasting the effort. Too much boost and you may not be able to keep the cylinder head on the engine.
Turbo charged and super charged aircraft engines do the same thing, as well as correct for low outside barametric pressure at higher altitudes.
Wolfman's science lesson 101 for the day.
Mike Wolford
CJ-2A
VEP GPW
Comm./Inst. SEL
AOPA ( 50 yrs)
EAA ( 49 yrs)
4th Inf. Div. - 5th Inf. Div. - 2nd Armor Div. - CIB

Fabrizio
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Fabrizio » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:55 am

Hey Luc, check this out!
Image
GPW #3606 “LIBBY”
"Jeep is America's only real sports car." - Enzo Ferrari

Rod Rushton
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Re: SU carburator on jeep

Post by Rod Rushton » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:06 am

Hello again Luc,
I read with interest your posts for and against various carburettor set ups. It would not be difficult to adapt the twin SU set as fitted to the old MGB. The performance option for them was to go to 2plus litres and incorporate 1 3/4" SU's. However, the Jeep has quite a long stroke and, in my opinion is more suited to the single carb.
I to, tinkered with my engine - fitting one of Herm's overdrives fitted to the later Hotchkiss transfer box with drum parking brake, breakerless distributor,12v alternator, quartz iodine headlights, paper air filter and a 12v geared starter motor. For carburation chose the single choke Weber, which is marketed as a replacement for the Series 2 Land Rover, and is a very easy fit, and tune. it is also cost effective when compared with the Solex and Carter. In addition it has proved very good on gas mileage and starting. I did all these modifications to give me a reliable running and driving vehicle. Having done about 4000 miles I am still very pleased with the results.

Most of these mods. don't look too out of place when the bonnet/hood is raised at shows - unless, of course, you are a rivet counter
Further development planned include the fitting of disc brakes to the front axle, as with advancing years has made camping in tents a thing of the past for me and the acquisition of a caravan will allow me to continue to attend shows, weekender events and am planning to go down to Saumur to the Tank Museum there in June, covering probably more than 1000 miles over a couple of weeks
CARB SET - UP 004.JPG
CARB SET - UP 004.JPG (129 KiB) Viewed 4404 times
Rod Rushton - Winner 2013 MVT Wilkinson Sword Trophy
Exeter Devon UK
FORD GPW 202055 DoD 5 - 22 - 44 Serial# 20534360
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1943 AUSTIN LIGHT UTILITY M6448770


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